Tri-City Speedway HUMPY'S STATEMENT!!!

I agree with everyone that the cost of racing is out of control. My family operated a kart track in Belleville for years and I watched the cost of competitive kart racing continue to escalate year after year. At the end of each year we would get together and discuss what could be done to help control the costs because kart counts were declining. We had lots of ideas (box stock motors/engine limits, tire rules, fuel rules, no prep, etc.) I understand this is on a smaller scale, however, the principle is the same.

I always come back to a few underlying questions when this topic comes up:
What should racing cost at your level? Who makes this determination? Who enforces it?
For example: How much should a person spend yearly to purchase and operate a Late Model to run locally? or a Modified? or a Pure Stock? Who sets the $ limit? Will all tracks adopt the same rules and enforce them?

I think it's great to have limits/rules to keep cost down but they have to be enforced and 'reasonable for racers.' In my experience, tire rules (like the 40's) mentioned above will help if enforced. That's not to say some guys won't put on new rubber all the time, but it will help even the field in certain track conditions. Rev limiters seem to work in several series when the cost of big motors are out of reach for most.

One thing is guaranteed, you can limit/govern racers in all forms of racing but they will find ways to engineer around the rules. Therefore, if tracks are going to help in controlling costs they must enforce the rules that are adopted.
 
t.nie said:
Most people race to win, not just drive around in circles to collect beer tokens. No rules would just make it easier for a couple people to dominate with unlimited money and run the majority off. If all you are doing is driving around in circles to get your $5 a lap and you could care less where you finish, I wouldn't really call that racing.

I'd call that "practicing."

And if you put some stipulation on the feature that you have to be on the lead lap after 20 laps or whatever to get a little more cash, now you are forcing people to spend enough in the class to keep up with the few rich kids spending a fortune or be lap traffic all night. So the decision at that point is how much do i have to spend to still lose but make a little more money by staying on the lead lap?

Again, I don't see much incentive to build a back marker, get lapped or not get lapped, and watch the unlimited money guys run away with it every night. Unless of course I have unlimited money and I just want to race with my few rich kid buddies every weekend to see who's buying the beer.
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the idea is for the amount per lap would be the same so if it was $5 dollars a lap and you were 1 lap down you would make $5 less than the rich kid. If the rich kid has a problem sharing his earnings there is the 2 big dog classes he can run in. I have seen guys dip their 401 and loan money on their house to race.There has to be a major change and over history rules have always changed but have never tried altering payout.
 
i completely agree with the 40 only rule. heck i remember watching my 1st mars race in the late 90s-early 00s in southern mo, they always had a 55 only rule and the racing was awesome and all the guys running the series seemed to love it. ever since that day, ive always thought all series and tracks should do the same.
 
Had my boy racing quarter midgets watched guys spend thousands of dollars just so their kid could win. There is no
payout we ran for a trophy. If they build it and the sanction body allows it the big money will run it no matter the cost or the payout.
 
Doesn't really matter what the rules are and what the pay is. Your always going to have the money teams that you have to deal with. But if you put the time in on your car, and actually work on it instead of just running it and adding fuel and changing your oil you can run up front with them and beat them on occasion. I dont have much in mine but it is a competitive car can run top five most nights if my driving is on..lol
 
little302 said:
Case in point.. Who has ever NOT enjoyed watching the vintage cars run?? They put on some of the best racing in the 2 classes they bring. Not to mention the nostalgia is great, and shows younger fans how they were built in the day.. Are we not all aware that they ALL get the same pay??? Does it hurt their show???. No.. They race hard as hell!! A pleasure to watch if you ask me! It can work... dont say it cant... It will have to be an economy class, but it will work.. Racing is racing... Speed is relative.. If you have passing and side by side racing, and fans with an interest in the class it WILL work. especially in a bullring..
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From a post I offered up on Facebook a while back regarding the early 80's era Allied / SARA modified and their recent increasing numbers with the Gateway Vintage Racing Association: "Imagine if the same specs were in place today, but dressed 'em up with newer bodies mixed in. Arrows and mustangs mixed in with Saturn's and Neons... might give the local scene a kick in the arse!"
 
Well after reading the first page - I will say this. If you do as someone said and "drop the late models and A mods" - you are done as a track. And "leaving them for the big money tracks"??? If there are none racing on a weekly basis - then WHERE are you going to get the ones for "the big money tracks"?
Go to a race sometime. Watch what happens if they run the Late Models and A Mod features first. (As it should be in my opinion). Half or more of the grandstand gets up and leaves after those two features. And you wanna tell me a track can make it without those two classes?
 
Racinfan83 said:
Well after reading the first page - I will say this. If you do as someone said and "drop the late models and A mods" - you are done as a track. And "leaving them for the big money tracks"??? If there are none racing on a weekly basis - then WHERE are you going to get the ones for "the big money tracks"?
Go to a race sometime. Watch what happens if they run the Late Models and A Mod features first. (As it should be in my opinion). Half or more of the grandstand gets up and leaves after those two features. And you wanna tell me a track can make it without those two classes?
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True that!
 
Racinfan83 said:
Well after reading the first page - I will say this. If you do as someone said and "drop the late models and A mods" - you are done as a track. And "leaving them for the big money tracks"??? If there are none racing on a weekly basis - then WHERE are you going to get the ones for "the big money tracks"?
Go to a race sometime. Watch what happens if they run the Late Models and A Mod features first. (As it should be in my opinion). Half or more of the grandstand gets up and leaves after those two features. And you wanna tell me a track can make it without those two classes?
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So your idea is let the promoter burn all his cash making sure the fans of Late Models and Modifieds get to see what they want, when they want. I think then the admission price should be adjusted so the Late Model and Modified fans alone get to provide all the money to pay those two classes. I would bet the admission price for Late Model and Modified fans woud be in the region of $50 to $100 per person then to ensure the $10000 plus cost of the purse for those two classes woud be paid for solely by the LM and Mod fans. As it should be.

You don't seem to understand that a racetrack is a business, and the purpose of a business is to keep the doors open and make money, and the way a racetrack can make money is by cutting the track costs. And when you look at the most expensive things you have to pay for on race night, the Late Model purse is at the very top of that list.

I don't know if you pay much attention to who is getting by as a promoter and who has gone under lately, but maybe it would behoove you to look at the finacnial situation overall of the people who are surviving and who is going under. In case you haven't noticed, the tracks where people are able to stay open have some obvious resources behind them not solely dependent on the front and back gate to make it through the lean weeks when it rains 3 out of 5 nights and no money comes in to pay the bills. This enable them to throw the big money maker shows as the season goes on.

If you look at the average joes who have tried to run a racetrack, they have to a man gone under trying. You can't stay open unless you have significant financial backing to absorb all the bad things that are going to happen for the first few years in any business, and race tracks are worse than most for eating away all your money. Look around, the only tracks open now have pretty deep pockets tto survive the weeks of paying out thousands upon thousands to the Late Models and Modifieds, and contrary to popular belief among LM and Mod devotees, no, they aren't the big money spinner, they are the big money pit classes for promoters.

If they were the money makers for racetracks, then Don Hoener would still be promoting Belleville, Mel Kinnaird would still have Montgomery County open and Godfrey would be open and racing and making money, Mt Vernon raceway would be open every weekend and countless other tracks across the country would be open and thriving,

Sorry, but I think it's time somebody tried something realistic with a racetrack and if an average Joe wants to have any hope of staying in business, forget Late Models and Modifieds and try something new and cost effective as far as front gate plus back gate plus concessions minus operating costs and purse. And the way to make money is to analyze your income to expense ration and cut the big tickett items and replace them with lower cost classes.

Nothing wrong with being a fan, but you have to make decisions as a promoter not on what classes you like to see, but what classes will cost you the least and make you the most money. And I'd bet if you had a conversation with some of these promoters who coudn't keep the doors open and asked them what their biggest expense was week to week, what bill they struggled to pay more than any other, it would be making the LM amd Mod purse. Ultimately those classes are what is putting the tracks out of busiiness.
 
Actually wouldn't be a bad idea to see the modifieds hang some fenders now that there is a B-mod class.....fans in the stands wouldnt know that it wasn't a late model and I mean fan's and not the family or neighbor of a late model driver... Highland, Tri City and Federated could alter running late models plus they have summer nationals to run if they want to.
Allied ran 3 classes for years and the stands had a lot more people in them because car counts were much higher and to me the racing was more competitive. But you will still need a cheap entry level race car that would cost about the same as the bombers use to cost, We used to only about 2 or 3 grand in our street stocks and had a blast racing them
 
We will never get enough to agree. All thats agreed apon is cost is ridiculous to race these days. But cutting cost ideas are gonna be all over the map. Its gonna take a track owner/promoter with balls to take the bulls by the horns and make changes. If not we can all just continue to watch the deterioration. Tough decisions have to be made and not everyone is gonna like them. But just like growing a plant.... sometimes it needs pruned to keep it flourishing. JMO
 
t.nie said:
So your idea is let the promoter burn all his cash making sure the fans of Late Models and Modifieds get to see what they want, when they want. I think then the admission price should be adjusted so the Late Model and Modified fans alone get to provide all the money to pay those two classes. I would bet the admission price for Late Model and Modified fans woud be in the region of $50 to $100 per person then to ensure the $10000 plus cost of the purse for those two classes woud be paid for solely by the LM and Mod fans. As it should be.

You don't seem to understand that a racetrack is a business, and the purpose of a business is to keep the doors open and make money, and the way a racetrack can make money is by cutting the track costs. And when you look at the most expensive things you have to pay for on race night, the Late Model purse is at the very top of that list.

I don't know if you pay much attention to who is getting by as a promoter and who has gone under lately, but maybe it would behoove you to look at the finacnial situation overall of the people who are surviving and who is going under. In case you haven't noticed, the tracks where people are able to stay open have some obvious resources behind them not solely dependent on the front and back gate to make it through the lean weeks when it rains 3 out of 5 nights and no money comes in to pay the bills. This enable them to throw the big money maker shows as the season goes on.

If you look at the average joes who have tried to run a racetrack, they have to a man gone under trying. You can't stay open unless you have significant financial backing to absorb all the bad things that are going to happen for the first few years in any business, and race tracks are worse than most for eating away all your money. Look around, the only tracks open now have pretty deep pockets tto survive the weeks of paying out thousands upon thousands to the Late Models and Modifieds, and contrary to popular belief among LM and Mod devotees, no, they aren't the big money spinner, they are the big money pit classes for promoters.

If they were the money makers for racetracks, then Don Hoener would still be promoting Belleville, Mel Kinnaird would still have Montgomery County open and Godfrey would be open and racing and making money, Mt Vernon raceway would be open every weekend and countless other tracks across the country would be open and thriving,

Sorry, but I think it's time somebody tried something realistic with a racetrack and if an average Joe wants to have any hope of staying in business, forget Late Models and Modifieds and try something new and cost effective as far as front gate plus back gate plus concessions minus operating costs and purse. And the way to make money is to analyze your income to expense ration and cut the big tickett items and replace them with lower cost classes.

Nothing wrong with being a fan, but you have to make decisions as a promoter not on what classes you like to see, but what classes will cost you the least and make you the most money. And I'd bet if you had a conversation with some of these promoters who coudn't keep the doors open and asked them what their biggest expense was week to week, what bill they struggled to pay more than any other, it would be making the LM amd Mod purse. Ultimately those classes are what is putting the tracks out of busiiness.
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Good post. You are correct it's a business and you need financial help to keep tracks open. There are several items that typically go unnoticed by most fans.
For example: Rain. You work all week (or half the week) paying track prep crew, fuel, maintenance, etc. and it rains out. The bills come in regardless. Land values. If you lease the track or the land the track is on those cost continue to rise. Liability insurance/Law suits. The cost of insurance continues to rise do to lawsuits. Most tracks are sued more than once each year (people falling, getting hit with dirt/rocks, etc.) When you add the cost of doing business with the items above and include things like vandalism, the economy, complaints from neighbors, competition from other entertainment venues, etc. it becomes more apparent that most people running successful race tracks have solid financial backing and truly love the sport. I can assure you the gentlemen mentioned above (Don, Mel and Rick) didn't walk away because they stopped caring about racing...

I've been to tracks all across the country and one thing is the same, it doesn't matter what class is on the track, if there are great drivers and great racing the grandstands are full and the fans are fired up about it!
 
hey tnie take gander at tri cities mod mania place is pack 18 dollar range for tickets and great car count
 
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