Good article about tires....

real racing fan

Exceptional Member
I like the last paragraph.

Too bad it seems to be becoming such a issue in the St. Louis area!!


Is Chemically Altering Tires a Competitive Advantage?

The sides are always divided when it comes to the discussion of racing tires. Some say racers need to get that “competitive advantage” by bending the rules just a little. Others simply believe that messing with the tires in any way that is not clearly allowed by the rule book is cheating and that cheaters should never win. Who’s right? As always, it depends completely on your point of view about “spirit and intent”.
Tires have been a hot topic for a long time, and it doesn’t look like the debates are going away any time soon. The subject has even found its way into courtrooms and laboratories. Rule makers, promoters, and those in charge feel the need to mandate certain matters when it comes to tires. It’s common to find exact tire compounds specifically spelled out in the rule book. In fact, the tire rules tend to be written with crystal clear parameters on tire compounds, while other portions of the book are much more general and vague such as certain safety gear simply being mentioned as “highly recommended”.
Of course, having detailed tire rules doesn’t stop some from tampering with the tire such as overlaying the correct compound number on an incorrect tire in hopes that the inspection is not as thorough as threatened in the drivers’ meeting. This little trick has happened in the past, therefore penalties are often specifically spelled out for tampering of any kind.

Taking Chances

Since racers never seem to be content with the status quo, they sometimes feel that an equal playing field is not always in their best interest. They feel that something has to be done in order to help them break away from the pack. Drivers will seek the best way to gain an advantage, and cost seldom enters into the equation. The consequences of getting caught seem to be of little concern, since there are plenty of racers who are willing to take their chances.
There have been some high profile Late Model races that have been “tainted” by drivers who were declared to be afoul of the rules with respect to “treating” tires. For illustration, let’s look at the Lucas Oil Dirt Late Model Series, which seems to be among the leaders in policing this infraction. Last August, a tire was taken from a competitor at an event at Tazewell Speedway in Tennessee. The tire was tested at an unidentified laboratory (left unidentified to protect integrity), and it was determined to be “chemically altered” to “enhance the performance of the tire”. The finding led to the disqualification of that racer along with penalties.
Lucas Oil Dirt Late Model Series punished drivers at the North/South 100 and Topless 100 for tire rule violations. In addition, the series announced that tires from the winning car at the North/South 100 in Florence, Kentucky, would be taken from the winner as well as select other drivers and tested. The winner’s purse would not be paid until the test results came back. Days after the race, Jimmy Mars received his $50,000 for winning the race on legal tires. Six other drivers were tested with just one, from the B main, out of line. It drove home the point that while not everyone is doing it, there is a risk for those who are.
Probably the most highly profiled case occurred at the Dirt Track at Lowe’s in November. The top six qualifiers had their tires inspected by officials of the World of Outlaws Late Model Series. Citing “reasonable suspicion” based on odor, the left rear tire from Scott Bloomquist’s car was whisked to a forensic lab where it failed the test. Bloomquist lost his purse money (more than $11,000), faces a fine equal to that amount, and cannot attempt to qualify for a World of Outlaws event until after May 10, 2010, which is essentially a six-month suspension.
The World of Outlaws cited rule 15.11, section G, which read in 2009: “Chemical alterations, vulcanizing, tire softening, defacing and/or altering the face of the tire lettering and/or tire stamping will not be permitted. Tires may be inspected at any time. Any violation with any tire presented for competition may result in immediate disqualification from the event and/or other penalties including but not limited to loss of money, fine, loss of points and/or suspension.” Basically, they threw the book at Bloomquist, but that’s the spirit and intent of rules.
The Lucas Oil Dirt Late Model Series clearly spells out its fines and penalties, and the sanctions handed down against the 2009 offenders is consistent with their intent to discourage tampering. Their rule states “no softeners or conditioners”. A failed durometer test causes a loss of starting position or disqualification for the night on a first offense. There’s a $1,500 fine, loss of 300 series points, no race winnings, and a fine to offset the cost of testing. A second offense is steep with the driver getting a $5,000 fine and the crew chief nailed for $2,500 plus point penalties. You don’t even want to know how severe a third offense can be!


Soaking Tires

Soaking a tire can be considered a traction control device due to the nature of the tire’s characteristics. A race tire is best when it’s new, therefore the objective is to put it into competition within a short time from when it was molded. Once you get the tires, experts advise keeping them in a cool dark place since heat and UV light can begin or expedite the aging process. Certain chemicals, when added to the tire, have a way of helping the tire maintain the elastic characteristics that help it grip the track. Essentially, a tire performs at its best when the footprint or surface area is greatest with the surface itself. More of the tire is getting onto the track, which is really helpful on dirt surfaces that are uneven and constantly changing. A soaked tire, with its heightened elasticity, is able to withstand the challenges and maintain a better grip, especially on rougher tracks.
While there are drivers who have used soaked tires for qualifying, the biggest advantage comes with the longer distance races. A slight advantage in lap times is multiplied by repeat trips around the rack. A savvy driver can make subtle changes to set-up and increase the performance potential. When soaked, the tires stay cooler and last longer. There is a misconception that the product used in soaking will make the tires “stickier”. There are two mains reason why that isn’t really the case. The first is that a stickier tire would immediately draw suspicion. The second is that adhesion is not the goal in soaking a tire. It takes an effort to remove something that sticks, and a tire that is adhering to the surface wastes time and energy in propelling the car.
Tire treatments are openly marketed because they are not considered illegal everywhere, so you may want to check your rules for the series or track where you plan to race. The promoters who don’t outlaw it are generally the ones who don’t have the resources or manpower to enforce the rule. Products like Pro Blend and Track Claw can be found at a number of reputable racing retailers. Track Claw is billed as a tire strengthener and not a softener, which is why some rule makers have changed the wording to read “chemically altered” rather than “softened”.


Tire Chemical Hazards

I asked Steve Black of Speed Pros if his shop carried tire chemicals. “No way,” he said emphatically. “It’s cheating,” he added, echoing the concerns of many. “It’s not safe, either.” The safety aspect has been another issue at the heart of the matter. These products, in most cases, contain very toxic chemicals. They contain hydrocarbons as the active ingredients. Some examples are benzene and toluene, a couple of chemicals that have been linked to causing cancer in humans. The tire prep manufacturers and retailers do acknowledge the potential hazards, however, most provide explicit instructions and safety guidelines. For example, one company recommends applying the product in a well-ventilated room. Steps like using gloves when applying the product and procedures for cleansing if there is skin contact are commonly found in the instruction sheet.
The health risk is one that cannot be ignored. East Bay Raceway Park in Florida clearly cites the danger in the rule book. Any track with environmental concerns, such as one that is careful with waste oil depositing or tire disposal, is not going to want this stuff anywhere near their place. In addition to the health risk situation, there’s also a little bit of danger involved regarding the integrity of the treated tire. The tire manufacturers are understandably cautious. One company, who doesn’t participate in dirt racing but is active in other aspects of the sport, has a very detailed warning on its website: “Never apply any type of chemical or tire dressing to the tires. TREAD SOFTENING OR ANY OTHER TYPE OF CHEMICAL APPLIED TO THE TIRES CAN AFFECT THE INTEGRITY OF THE TIRE. Failure to follow this advice may result in catastrophic failure of the tire and could lead to serious injuries or death.”


Detecting Tire Tampering

Officials are having to be pro-active in their means to detect any alteration. The use of a “tire sniffer” is a popular enforcement tool. The manufacturers of tire prep products have become aware of this, and one company uses the “wintergreen scent” of their product as a selling point. Another company boasts, “Our preps simply do not have a strong offensive smell; all are very mild natural smells. This keeps the competition from ‘sniff testing’ your tires. They won’t know what you’re using unless you’re nice enough to tell them.” And, who would tell anyone? Can you trust anyone who’s in competition with you, especially when you’re doing something that’s against the rules?
When tire sniffers come up with an odor that indicates the presence of a chemical that shouldn’t be on a tire, series officials will take action. At a recent NeSmith Chevrolet Late Model Series race, the tool found 13 drivers in a field of 60 before qualifying. Those drivers were forced to change tires and run at the rear of the heat race, making transfer to the A main a bit more difficult. Despite the high number of offending drivers, there wasn’t a mad rush to the tire shed. This indicated that there were “legal” tires already in the trailer, they just weren’t being used.
Enforcement continues to be a big part of why these chemicals are still around. Some say there wouldn’t be a problem if everyone was allowed to use them, but that discounts factors like the health risk and environmental dangers. Some promoters are afraid to put the rules in place because they can’t enforce them. The current scenario requires suspicious tires to be sent to a laboratory for spectrum analysis in order to determine the chemical composition of an object. Tires are created with a specific formula with a compound of elements that interact in a way to create the product with certain desired characteristics. A batch of tires are mixed and molded with these chemicals. The presence of a chemical not found in the formula will trigger that someone has altered it.
While the exact cost is unknown, it can’t be cheap to utilize these services. We have heard estimates of $200 to $300 for each test. The $1,500 fine assessed on guilty parties by the Lucas Oil Dirt Late Model Series is set aside for the tire testing program. A guilty party will pay for the costs of the test, but who pays when the tire is found to be unaltered? That’s where the fine money comes into play. Series have seemingly vowed not to let the cost become an issue, and there seems to be an increased effort to step up enforcement. High profile events like the World 100 have made no bones about not tolerating the practice.


How Bad Is The Problem?

The reality is that the situation is probably more widespread than anyone will ever know. A driver may only alter tires for certain tracks or certain situations, always hoping to stay a step ahead of the enforcers. The competitive advantage is always the driving factor. There’s a saying that is often heard, “It’s only cheating if you get caught.” The bulk of those who are using chemicals (they know who they are, but they’re not telling anyone) are putting themselves at risk. Race purse, point money, sponsorship opportunities, and reputation can be tarnished. A crew member could get cancer because of exposure. It would seem the negatives outweigh the positives, but apparently not enough to keep it from happening.
As long as there is competition, there will always be a desire to win. Sometimes that desire comes at any cost. It’s up to the individual to determine if that cost is worth it.
 
Hey bleedblue did ya read this? May cause cancer. What happens if a crew member gets cancer cuz of your tire treating. I can bet they will see you in court and sue your butt!
 
I've said it once, twice, a million times, nothing I use is cancer causing. Everything is EPA friendly, OSHA friendly, everybody friendly. I don't use the types of chemical mentioned in that article. Those are all harsh solvents, mine are not.
 
Nick is right, there are no known carcinogens in his prep. Chemicals are a very touchy subject in stock car racing. Some chemicals people use in preps are very dangerous, but there are chemicals that will work even better that are a much safer alternative than those. Our company deals with chemicals in racing and also the textile industry, we keep thousands of raw chemicals in the plant at a time and none of those chemicals are on the EPA or DEA hit list or a known carcinogen. I will agree the tire deal in stock cars have gotten way out of hand but until theres a 100% fool proof way of stopping it the drama is going to keep going on. Sniffers, durometers, and labs are a joke when it comes to teching tires. The only way to put a stop to it is everyone buy and mount tires at the track and keep the tires impounded until it hits the track. As far as this article, who ever wrote that article is very misinformed and has no logic of tire preps and the chemicals used in the production of tire treatments. There have been a lot of tracks this year realize it is almost impossible to control the tire treating so they have given up on it. I know of a recent WoO race that payed $20,000 and the winners tires were not even looked at. Tire treating has been around for very long time and will be an issue until the end of racing. I understand peoples concern about safety but I wish everyone would do a little research before making assumptions that your going to die from treating tires. I wonder how many peoples lives were cut short in racing accidents vs prepping tires in the shop? We all know the sport we love is a dangerous one and it has very high risks, but that doesnt stop us from racing every weekend.

This is my final though of the post:
I wonder how many people that are complaining about how dangerous tire treatment can be to your health are smoking a cigarette and drinking a beer why they type. hmmmmm, that would be interesting to know. The safety issue is a cover up for people that dont understand tires and treating them to match the race surface.
 
trac - tac products

your final thought was freakin retarded! It doesnt matter if the chemicals nick is using are harmful to anyones health or not.the rules say you can not treat tires!!!!! I dont have a problem with him helping the karting series if it is legal there.selling drugs are illigal,robbing banks are illigal,car theft is illigal,its all the same.nick is the one to blame because he gets on here and brags about his product being undetectable.almost like he is proud of helping people cheat. I think people like him and you are are destroying our sport.I would get much more satisfaction winning knowing my car was legal. But i guess nicks customers feel their driving talants are as good as other drivers so they need a little advantage.jmo
 
If I come off to be bragging or coc*ky that is not my intent. That's the problem with type, texting, ect, sometimes things get taken the wrong way. I'm confident in what I do, I'm confident in my ability, and I'm confident in the products I use, well if that's bragging then I apologize.
 
People have been prepping tires for decades in this sport and nobody cared or made a big deal about it until sanctioning bodies thought they could put a stop to it. I know of a NASCAR owner that still has the tire rotisserie that has a device that needles the tires as they turn on the rotisserie, this is what they used on their cup cars in the 60's and 70's. If it werent for the big uproar that happened at speed weeks a few years back people would be prepping tires not arguing about it. I race myself and I dont cheat, Im not on here encouraging people to cheat, Im just giving information to the public.

Since you are so against people cheating and the people that help them why arent you going after other people. Theres a list of cheating engine builders across the country that would take you 2 days to type. What about the fuel companies that make hot fuel, or the oil companies that make hot oil, or what about the traction control that all stock car people complained about for so many years until they realized that the four tires are the only thing that touches the racetrack? I dont see any of your posts where you telling them how they are destroying your sport. Obviously the tire treatment must be the only thing people are beating you with, or maybe its the only thing people have a real advantage with if they know what they are doing.

Dont jump on my case because you didnt read the post thoroughly and see that Im not trying to sell prep to guys that arent supposed to run it. Im not trying to sell prep on here at all, just telling the truth on a subject matter a lot of people dont understand.
 
You bring up the point of people smoking and drinking

What I subject myself to is My Business

What somebody else subjects me to with out my consent is an entirely different matter

Remember every where you go you leave a little of yourself and take home a little of where you have been

Also I will ask this question once last time

If Bleed blues product is so EPA friendly

Why can he not ship it to California

I wonder if maybe it is not as environmentally friendly as he says


Any reputable company will supply you with the MSDS sheet on request

But Bleed blue wants you to buy his product in order for you to get his MSDS sheet


Oh and at one time Asbestos was not a known carcinogen
 
Track-Tac, yes there are engine builders and others who have done things that are illegal, but the don't deliver their products to the tracks which is one big complaint on this subject!!! Another problem is those of us who would like to know what we are being subject to that could be floating in the air at the tracks we love.(Just like the post above says!) Rules are Rules, and you say you don't like cheating but like was said before, bleed blue brags on how undetectable his treatments are, that is where people are getting really upset with him, he says it's ok to cheat because you won't get caught. I have heard first hand from some that have been around his "safe" chemical treatments, their comments were " That dude won't live long doing that crap! "
 
You bring up the point of people smoking and drinking

What I subject myself to is My Business

What somebody else subjects me to with out my consent is an entirely different matter

Remember every where you go you leave a little of yourself and take home a little of where you have been

Also I will ask this question once last time

If Bleed blues product is so EPA friendly

Why can he not ship it to California

I wonder if maybe it is not as environmentally friendly as he says


Any reputable company will supply you with the MSDS sheet on request

But Bleed blue wants you to buy his product in order for you to get his MSDS sheet


Oh and at one time Asbestos was not a known carcinogen

Unleaded gas that is run in race cars is illegal in California.

Robbing banks, dealing meth, murder are all things that are made illegal by the federal/state legal system and will not be changed any time soon. The rules on tire prepping could change tomorrow if UMP or anyone deems necessary. It is not the same as robbing banks, get real! I know that the rules are specific on altering tires, and I know it is cheating, but seriously, going as far to crucify anyone who markets preps is a little outrageous. What will you say next year, if/when it is deemed legal by sanctioning bodies?

Tire prepping is illegal by the rulebook. So are:

Altered frames, wheelbases less than 108", minimum frame to ground height less than 4", roofs higher than 52", not wearing fire protective gloves, etc.

If your car passes every line of the rulebook, then congrats. IF not, then you may be a hypocrite if you are so upset by tire prepping.

My point is, if you consider tire prepping cheating by the UMP rulebook, then you must also consider not wearing driving gloves cheating by the UMP rulebook.
 
Unleaded gas that is run in race cars is illegal in California.

Robbing banks, dealing meth, murder are all things that are made illegal by the federal/state legal system and will not be changed any time soon. The rules on tire prepping could change tomorrow if UMP or anyone deems necessary. It is not the same as robbing banks, get real! I know that the rules are specific on altering tires, and I know it is cheating, but seriously, going as far to crucify anyone who markets preps is a little outrageous. What will you say next year, if/when it is deemed legal by sanctioning bodies?

Tire prepping is illegal by the rulebook. So are:

Altered frames, wheelbases less than 108", minimum frame to ground height less than 4", roofs higher than 52", not wearing fire protective gloves, etc.

If your car passes every line of the rulebook, then congrats. IF not, then you may be a hypocrite if you are so upset by tire prepping.

My point is, if you consider tire prepping cheating by the UMP rulebook, then you must also consider not wearing driving gloves cheating by the UMP rulebook.



http://www.arb.ca.gov/enf/advs/advs397.pdf

Why dont you state the whole fact

It is also illegal to put race gas in any street vehicle in Missouri
as the road use tax has not been paid


No body but you brought up Bank robbing What is the point of that

If you break the rules and get caught dont cry when you have to pay the price

Personally I would love to see the cars teched in at the start of the night

Every one has access to the rule book If you are found to be illegal

You should forfeit all money won for the night and pay a fine equal to the first place money paid to the winner and on top of that you should lose all the points you have accumulated for the year

This will not stop until the penalties hit the offenders where it hurts.... In the checkbook


And remember rules are rules if you dont like them you are welcome to start up your own association and set the rules to anything that you want

If you chose to not wear race gloves as far as I am concerned you have failed to follow the rules and should forfeit all money and points for the night

Problem settled

I bet you will have them on the next time
 
Which MSDS sheets do you feel you need? I can provide the handling and shipping MSDS, but I don't have the content MSDS to give you. Track Tac has those and I don't believe they or I am required to give those. As far as I understand I have everything I need, and the other part is on file with Chemtrek in case of a spill or if the EPA comes to my shop. Everything I have is labeled properly and has the Chemtrek number on it. If you need anything further than that then call Chris or Randy at Track Tac and see what they have to offer, anything more than that I can not help you with.

Other than to stop selling my products what else do you want from me? I'm not going to stop selling products from my shop. I do not sell then anywhere other than the shop. I don't sell then at the track, and I will never bring a tire to any track ever again. What more do you want?!?!?
 
bleed blue

As much as i hate to say it every time someone asks bleed blue a question it seems like he gives them an honest answer.I dont agree with the products he is selling,but who am i to judge.these posts could go on forever and ever and nothing is ever gonna change.the guys out there cheating are still gonna cheat no matter what.I just think the fines and suspensions should be so stiff that people might actually think about it before they do it.I remember when we used to race it used to be so much fun,now i am getting to the point where i dont even care if i go to the races.good luck to all the guys who are out there cheating,take advantage while you can cuz everyone gets caught eventually.and to all the guys who are doing it the honest way keep up the good work and kick their asses.lol....
 
If any body would go back and read any of Bleed blues responses you would find
all the key words he is so fond of using like
I DONT BELIEVE
I DONT THINK
I AM NOT AWARE
AS FAR AS I UNDERSTAND
and other such nonsense

here it is BLEED BLUE in black and white
What you are required to have on the MSDS sheet
any more questions?

http://www.meridianeng.com/msds.html

Why dont you just print The MSDS sheet here

You always claim that it is not hazardous

PROVE IT

WHY cant you ship or import your product to California
What is in it that has been BANNED from the State

I think it is time to put up or or take your poison elsewhere
 
Why are you asking what is in it thats banned in CA? There are a lot of things banned in CA that arent banned in other states. There are preps that are made by Randy at Track Tac that are not harsh at all to the environment or users. Randy and Eric R. work closely in NC to formulate these and i believe this is who Nick gets his product from. I am not condoning cheating according to the UMP rulebook. I just know that in karts, its all legal and we use products that are not unsafe.
 
It is illegal in UMP and all major sanctioning bodies of dirt track racing!

Until I see a full list of chemicals used, I will never believe anything that is harsh enough to change the properties of tires is completely "safe". Those who do it sure wear plenty of protection to keep it from getting on them.
 
WAKE UP PEOPLE...if tire doping, soaking, anything involving some chemicals and compounds DOES NOT STOP...there will be no where to race within 5 years!
 
I don't know the full list of chemical in the product. What I do know is that it is made my ATTL(Track Tac) and that company is open to inspection at anytime by the EPA, OSHA, and DEA. Nothing is on a ban list and nothing causes cancer. There are products made by other companies that do, but not this one and that is why I deal with them. If you want a full break down of any product I sell then like I said before call Chris or Randy and see if they will give it to you. I know they will give you the handling/shipping MSDS, but good luck from there.
 
you keep referring to it being legal in karting to prep tires and IT SHOULD NOT be if you race on dirt you guys should run dirt treaded tires not slicks slick have screwed up kart racing i went to a kart race last year and it was a joke when i raced karts we ran treaded tires and had multiple racing groove lots of close racing what i saw then was a joke the only way to pass was to beat the heck out of the guy in front of you please keep YOUR dam tire prep out of our racing !!!!!!
 




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