UMP needs to go away,,,,,,for B Mods

Why should a guy that doesn't run a crate motor have to add weight? Why should a crate motor get a weight break? Just forget they even make a crate motor is what ump should do. This class was started as a 2 brrl class. Now it has gotten out of hand. If you want to run a crate motor fine but it should have to be done on a 2 brrl carb. If ump mandates the crate motor which it looks like they will it will be the demise of the bmod class.
 
I'd like the motor rules to be toned down a bit, just for the simple fact that none of us open motor guys can even get close to legal for the USRA shows. There are ALWAYS races that pay $2-3k or more for them, and more all the time.

But really, uniform rules and TECH.. I'll change my car to fit without complaint.
 
wahooracing said:
Why should a guy that doesn't run a crate motor have to add weight? Why should a crate motor get a weight break? Just forget they even make a crate motor is what ump should do. This class was started as a 2 brrl class. Now it has gotten out of hand. If you want to run a crate motor fine but it should have to be done on a 2 brrl carb. If ump mandates the crate motor which it looks like they will it will be the demise of the bmod class.
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The reason that they give them a weight break is simply because the 602 crate engine needs that to help it compete with a 2 barrel 355. It isn't terribly difficult to make more than 400 horsepower with a tech legal 4412 carburetor and the 602 engines make a little over 400. But horsepower isn't the be all end all in a racing engine. The crankshaft in the 602 weighs 54lbs and that can't be changed but its easy to make the crank much lighter in a custom built engine so in order to run similarly the car would have to be somewhat lighter.
 
first lets throw out the idea of piecing an engine together. If you piece something together on a budget you either have connections to get parts cheap, you have acquired parts over the years where you are able to do this, you have a really crappy engine, or you have a may-pop.

In my opinion the crate engine ($3500 brand new) should look more desireable to a person rather than spending $6000-$10,000 on a brand new 355. Thats why I think they should get an advantage. Do you forget that a crate engine is 9.5 to 1 compression, hydraulic cam, stock rocker arms, etc
 
Jimmy Cummins said:
Please explain how you would explain in a rule book "no high dollar carbs, no high dollar shocks, no high dollat motors"
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Stock carb out of box with no alterations, limit what shocks you can run, no 30,000 dollar motors. I'm sure you guys know what rules to write for the motor so, you don't have 30,000 in it.
 
Jimmy Cummins said:
first lets throw out the idea of piecing an engine together. If you piece something together on a budget you either have connections to get parts cheap, you have acquired parts over the years where you are able to do this, you have a really crappy engine, or you have a may-pop.

In my opinion the crate engine ($3500 brand new) should look more desireable to a person rather than spending $6000-$10,000 on a brand new 355. Thats why I think they should get an advantage. Do you forget that a crate engine is 9.5 to 1 compression, hydraulic cam, stock rocker arms, etc
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I was incorrect earlier the 604 makes a little over 400 horsepower but the 602 with the flat tappet, iron heads, dual plane etc only makes around 350 horsepower. I don't think that for $3500 that the 602 is all that great of a deal. Cast pistons, stock rods, cast crank, stock rocker etc that's not the stuff of a real race engine even one that's built on a budget.

With close to a 50 horsepower deficit to most reasonably good 4412 carburetor equipped engines it needs a big weight break.
 
I understand why you don't think 4 links should be allowed but around here before Highland started to run the b mods Fulton, mmp, farmington, and the lake all allowed 4 link cars with no cubic inch rule. So why would you build a 3 link with a 355.If you don't allow those cars you are just penalizing the guys that have been running this class for years not the guys that just started in the b mods and want to change everything
 
Couple of things to add regarding the 602 crate.

HP isn't everything, the motor is drive able and has some good torque.

The parts mentioned above allow this motor to run a lot longer before needing freshened. These motors are practically indestructible.

I think they should be encouraged through the incentive of the weight break. I don't agree with mandating a specific motor though.

Wahoo, why are you so against the crate? It's an affordable motor that allows others to compete. The 4bbl is a must to allow it to be comparable to the 355's.
 
If you don't run a chevy there is not an option. That is what is wrong. Wahoo is die hard ford man and should be allowed to run what they want. Also the rev limiter rule should be enforced. Never ask the racer because they will always do what's best for themselves
 
Im not against crates at all just letting them run a 4 bbl is my complaint Dont like it dont get one You can say all you want about the 602 and a 355 but i ran a 355 stock pistons decent cam and 462 heads most i got out of it was 390 on a dyno and that was with an out of the box 4412 No i didnt " tinker " with it and try to get more out of it But in an economy class 4 bbl's should not be allowed to be use no matter whst you have I like the idea of crates but to make it the kiss rule( keep it simple stupid) then thats where it should be No 4 bbl's 3 link or leafs 100 lbs for berts and a 355(no roller cams) and 9 to 1 only
 
zerop said:
If you don't run a chevy there is not an option. That is what is wrong. Wahoo is die hard ford man and should be allowed to run what they want. Also the rev limiter rule should be enforced. Never ask the racer because they will always do what's best for themselves
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Grest post
 
I have a 2001 Fr1 leaf spring car with a 9:1 usra/imca legal claim engine with tires on it from last season and 10$ swap meet shocks and a 3spd tranny. I finished 2nd at tri-city a couple weeks ago to a create engine. Open motored 4 bar cars with Bert trannys don't matter. Stop WHINING about everything and race what you have. A big spenders gonna spend, no matter what the rules! The tri city rule package is perfect. The carb limits the open motor. THATS THE WHOLE POINT OF A 2bbl. The create is limited by design. Leave it alone. The idea of saving someone $ by adding more rules is absurd to me. The government tries to do the same crap.
 
Rev limiter chip should be enforced. Then let's see how some of the crate motors run. The track supplies the chip. Dave why should I be forced to run a crate? I run Ford. So my junk Ford bmod motor on the dyno was pumping out a whopping 355 horses so does that mean I get a 4 brrl also?
 
wahooracing said:
Rev limiter chip should be enforced. Then let's see how some of the crate motors run. The track supplies the chip. Dave why should I be forced to run a crate? I run Ford. So my junk Ford bmod motor on the dyno was pumping out a whopping 355 horses so does that mean I get a 4 brrl also?
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It's your choice. Just because your ford can't produce the power and you choose to run it doesn't mean everyone else should be restricted. Think about it as a whole rather than just how it affects you.
 
T.C. Springer said:
100lbs for a Bert? Wow.
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Yes 100 lbs 50 lbs doesnt make much of a difference in my opinion and if you weigh a bert versus stock trans and clutch it is about 50 lbs difference but then factor in less rotating mass is why i said 100 lbs Some tracks are 100 some are 50 Im not out of the ballpark in saying that as others mandate that too
 
I dont hate berts I dont like them either In an economy class i dont see a need for them at all Yes the argument is its just as much cost to run either or but i can buy a decent " stock " clutch for 150 and a 3 spd for 100(yes they are still out there for around that price) and a used bert is around 600 or so 100 lbs is not going to make or break a guy running a bert
 
Dave34 said:
It's your choice. Just because your ford can't produce the power and you choose to run it doesn't mean everyone else should be restricted. Think about it as a whole rather than just how it affects you.
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Ford makes a crate engine too and it's superior to the GM crate stuff. Maybe they should mandate that everyone run the Ford engine.

Another option would be to not give a weight break to the 602 engine but put the 2 barrel engines on the 7448 on a Performer intake then the power levels would be pretty close.
 
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