locked front end vs. TRACTION CONTROL

demoderbydude

SHOCK EM
There have been a lot of complaints latly about locked front ends and the issue of being illegal. I can say from experience, that the benefits of the locked front end are simple;
1. makes it easier to not wash all the way up the track in the corner if you roll off the throttle a little bit. (safety issue to me)
2. allows for the use of both front tire traction coming out of the corner. (does not add power, just lets you use it. BUT, the dires will still break loose if you are on the gas too hard.)
We have been open about having our front end locked from day one. And i can say we are not the only ones with this done. That being said i found this on the web the other day and i figured i would open up everyones eyes about a few other car makes we race against.

Anti-lock Brake System. Available on all Saturn models. The Saturn ABS system comes standard with Traction Control.
ABS FAQ:
How does ABS work? Sensors are located on each wheel. The sensors are connected to an electronic control unit.
When you brake in emergency stopping situations (slam on the brakes), the sensors detect when a wheel is about to lock (stop turning and start skidding). The ABS system pumps the brakes several times per second (much faster than you can do it).
What's the big deal? You can still steer the car when the wheels are turning. The ABS system keeps the wheels turning and the tires in contact with the road so you are much less likely to skid off the road.
Let's recap: Emergency stop. Wheels keep spinning with ABS. You still have the ability to steer the car. If you can steer the car, you stand a better chance of avoiding an accident. Any questions?
Will I stop faster? NO. This is important. You will not stop any faster with ABS. ABS helps avoid braking skids allowing you more opportunity to steer and avoid accidents.
How can I tell if the ABS is working? When activated, you will feel a pulsation in the brake pedal. You will also hear audible feedback, sort of a thumping sound, when the ABS is working. L and S series cars use similar ABS systems but the sounds will be different due to the weight and structure of the cars.
Remember: If you feel a pulsation in the brake pedal during ABS operation, then the system is working normally. Repeat after me: I will keep my foot on the brake even though it feels weird.
ABS History:
Anti-lock Brakes/Traction Control: Available on all Saturn models in some part since the first cars in 1991.
1991 - 1992 Model Years: ABS only optional across all models. 1991 Featured only the SL, SL1, SL2, and SC models. Traction control was not offered. All models with ABS get 4 wheel disc brakes.
1993 - 1995: Full Model Line introduced (SL, SL1, SL2, SC1, SC2, SW1, SW2) in 1993
Automatic transmission: Traction Control standard with ABS. Automatic models ONLY got the ABS with traction control.
Manual transmission: Optional ABS only. No traction control offered with manual transmissions.
Brakes: 1993 & 1994 models get ABS with 4 wheel disc brakes. Starting in 1995, ABS with 4 wheel disc brakes were only on the SL2 and SC2. In other words, all models with ABS used front disc and rear drum brakes except the the SL2 and SC2.
1996 - 2002: ABS with traction control optional across all models and transmissions. 1996 - 1998 SL2 and SC2 models continued to receive 4 wheel disc brakes. Beginning in 1999, all Saturn vehicles came standard with front disk and rear drums for both ABS/Traction control and standard configurations.

Also says some of the newer cavys come with traction control.

Kinda does the same thing as a locked front end, but no one is threatening to claim these cars. They win too. What gives?
 
First off, traction control and anti-lock brakes are stock and a locked front end is not! Second, all the front running Saturn’s and Cavalier’s at Highland and Tri-City are using a Dodge Caravan hub and spindle on their RR. (For Safety) This eliminates the wheel speed sensor on that wheel which causes the anti-lock and traction control to be in operational. If you think the Saturn’s are so dominant then leave your junk at home, make the trip to Tri-City, and I’ll have a car waiting for Chris! ;)
 
PS. Take the money you guys won this year and buy a transmission or run your locked front end all you want and I think I speak for everyone at Tri-City; JUST NOT AT OUR TRACK!


There have been a lot of complaints latly about locked front ends and the issue of being illegal. I can say from experience, that the benefits of the locked front end are simple;
1. makes it easier to not wash all the way up the track in the corner if you roll off the throttle a little bit. (safety issue to me)
2. allows for the use of both front tire traction coming out of the corner. (does not add power, just lets you use it. BUT, the dires will still break loose if you are on the gas too hard.)
We have been open about having our front end locked from day one. And i can say we are not the only ones with this done. That being said i found this on the web the other day and i figured i would open up everyones eyes about a few other car makes we race against.
 
Yea, I forgot that caravan parts came stock on saturns and cavaliers. Say what you will, if the 23 car was running around the back at tricity, you wouldnt be sayin ****. The fact that a sohc from pevely comes over and takes home some money just pisses some people off. O freakin well. All we ever hear about is how pevely needs to run the dohc cars and blah blah blah. So myself and several others busted our asses to lobby allied to make that happen. It did. Now everyone wants to eliminate our cars from tri city. I will take that as a thanks. what needs to happen is everyone get along, race, and have fun. as long as you are not crashin our stuff up, we are cool. Less cryin= better racin
 
The rules at Highland allow everyone to use a stronger rear hub. I have spoken with Kevin G. and have the ok with him as well. If you would like I can post video of at least 4 of my cars flipping and being destroyed from rear hubs braking. One year I broke 9 and totaled 2 cars.

http://www.highlandspeedway.com/index.php/rules/2009-hornet-rules
Passenger tires must be 60 series or taller only. Wheels and tires must be of same size left to right on the front and rear. No grooving or siphoning of tires. Racing wheels are mandatory for right side. Left side racing wheels are optional. Racing steel wheels no offset. Wheel studs can be drilled and bigger. No bead lock wheels. One inch lug nuts are mandatory. Wheels cannot proceed past body. Tread must be 7“maximum. Heavier spindles can be used on the right side. There must be a minimum tire pressure of 30 lb on all 4 tires after the race by the track tire gauge. If you are found illegal all points and money for the night will be forfeited.

I have heard of the use of Dodge caravan parts on the right rear
, but for a different purpose than just safety!
 
I don’t know if you think I’m some dumb punk or what but it sounds to me like you’re trying to get everyone from I-55 all riled up. No one is trying to keep the Pevely cars away from Tri-City and I’m willing to put Chris in my own personal car until he gets his fixed. I looked up the I-55 rules and it doesn’t have anything about allowing differentials to be welded at that track. You and I could probably tear down and put a transmission back together with a blindfold on but most cant and most of those can’t afford to pay someone too. Just because a few of the drivers took it upon them selves to make their own rules doesn’t mean that they are legal at Pevely. Remember, you and Chris are the ones who are admitting to the locked front end. The more people that feel their not getting cheated the more that will get into this class.

I-55 Rules:
http://www.i55raceway.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=18&Itemid=36


Yea, I forgot that caravan parts came stock on saturns and cavaliers. Say what you will, if the 23 car was running around the back at tricity, you wouldnt be sayin ****. The fact that a sohc from pevely comes over and takes home some money just pisses some people off. O freakin well. All we ever hear about is how pevely needs to run the dohc cars and blah blah blah. So myself and several others busted our asses to lobby allied to make that happen. It did. Now everyone wants to eliminate our cars from tri city. I will take that as a thanks. what needs to happen is everyone get along, race, and have fun. as long as you are not crashin our stuff up, we are cool. Less cryin= better racin
 
No Rob, I dont think you are dumb, nor am i trying to get the pevely people riled up. I can count on 1 hand the pevely cars that have been to tri city this year. Going through the points standings at I-55 this year, I can count over 25 cars that have their front/ rear end locked that i know for a fact. That is not counting the people i dont know. Thats a pretty good percentage. The truth is, it makes the cars handle better (which is a safty issue) which makes for better racing. I-55 knows this, And being the best dirt track in the area, they have chosen to not make a big deal about this. That is the only thing done to the drivetrain of the 23 car, and if that is what you want to make a big deal about then so be it. We wont race at your track anymore. But when i look at those results and see that same car that has won most of the features there and at other tracks on the top again, i will know its not about whats beating you, its who is beating you.
 
I would like to see AARA post an approval for lock front ends at I-55! If they do then so be it but if Pevely allows DOHC next year I will be pushing no locked diffs there as well.


PS. I have lost far more than I have won…. Keep pushing buttons maybe you’ll hit the right one!:)
 
Just curious, if there isn't a rule against it then how is it illegal?

If I-55 is going to allow DOHC next year then you got a whole new ballgame to contend with. If so, does that mean the Shaw cars are coming down, maybe along with Zbinden and other Tri City cars????? The 4 cylinder class at Pevely might be something to keep an eye on.
 
I would like to see AARA post an approval for lock front ends at I-55! If they do then so be it but if Pevely allows DOHC next year I will be pushing no locked diffs there as well.


PS. I have lost far more than I have won…. Keep pushing buttons maybe you’ll hit the right one!:)

I am trying to push as many buttons as i can, but with a broken arm it is a little slower than usual. O well, at least being off work gives me a lot of time to sit here and create and be a part of these debates. I enjoy hearing everyones opinions and trying to understand where they come from. Anyway, after this seasons big races, we will not have any interest in the pro-4 class as far as driving, just continue building and repairing cars for our customers. Thinking of maybe a house car or 2. One single and one dual for whoever to drive as advertising. I think thats the plan. I enjoy that just as much as racing them. Hopefully we can get Chris's mod back out and try to get some wins in that. We are gonna have to get a lot more $$$$$ for that to happen.
 
Jimmy,

The first rule from I-55 is:

1. Any car or truck with a single cam 4 cylinder engine may be run. Must be completely stock as manufactured, engine, drive train, suspension and fuel system, except as noted below.

It then goes on to say nothing about locked diffs. So would this mean it is illegal to lock them?

Just curious, if there isn't a rule against it then how is it illegal?

If I-55 is going to allow DOHC next year then you got a whole new ballgame to contend with. If so, does that mean the Shaw cars are coming down, maybe along with Zbinden and other Tri City cars????? The 4 cylinder class at Pevely might be something to keep an eye on.
 
Nathan,

We always enjoy racing with all the guys from I-55, especially Chris. You have noted that a locked front end is far better than an open one. Tri-City’s rule is no lock diffs so we run ours open, which in your theory puts us at a disadvantage compared to a car that is locked. My offer still stands; Chris can come by and pick out any one of my cars to race Tri-City.:)



I am trying to push as many buttons as i can, but with a broken arm it is a little slower than usual. O well, at least being off work gives me a lot of time to sit here and create and be a part of these debates. I enjoy hearing everyones opinions and trying to understand where they come from. Anyway, after this seasons big races, we will not have any interest in the pro-4 class as far as driving, just continue building and repairing cars for our customers. Thinking of maybe a house car or 2. One single and one dual for whoever to drive as advertising. I think thats the plan. I enjoy that just as much as racing them. Hopefully we can get Chris's mod back out and try to get some wins in that. We are gonna have to get a lot more $$$$$ for that to happen.
 
Jimmy,

The first rule from I-55 is:

1. Any car or truck with a single cam 4 cylinder engine may be run. Must be completely stock as manufactured, engine, drive train, suspension and fuel system, except as noted below.

It then goes on to say nothing about locked diffs. So would this mean it is illegal to lock them?

I am not arguing for it, just jumping in on a debate. Seeing if you guys can back up your arguments. As far as anti lock brakes, aren't you suppose to be racing not stopping? My personal opinion I agree with you, if you alter a 4 cylinder CAR in any way it should be deemed illegal. Yes I have raced that class at I-55 completely legal and always finished in the top 5, never once did I feel unsafe with an open diff.
If the DOHC rule is true are the Shaw cars coming to Pevely next year or are you gonna stay at Highland( come on now, those high banks are fun)? If that is true I am going to re-think the car that is about to be running.
 
Nathan,

We always enjoy racing with all the guys from I-55, especially Chris. You have noted that a locked front end is far better than an open one. Tri-City’s rule is no lock diffs so we run ours open, which in your theory puts us at a disadvantage compared to a car that is locked. My offer still stands; Chris can come by and pick out any one of my cars to race Tri-City.:)

I dont think it is soooooo much better than the open diff. It just drives better in the corners which makes it SAFER.
Also, Chris ran that car at the nationals last year and finished 2nd, and won a feature at pevely and tri city this year before we locked it up. He just didnt like the way the car drifted in the middle of the corners with it open. Just a FYI.
 
Keep digging that hole. No one is buying what you're selling!

"1. makes it easier to not wash all the way up the track in the corner
2. allows for the use of both front tire traction coming out of the corner"
 
Also, Chris ran that car at the nationals last year and finished 2nd, and won a feature at pevely and tri city this year before we locked it up. He just didnt like the way the car drifted in the middle of the corners with it open.

I know you can read, and this is the truth. We have nothing to hide. I offered several months back to let anyone come and pick at this car with a fine tooth comb if they had a problem, and nobody did.

I'm digging as fast as i can Rob, but it's hard to do with one arm. lol
 




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