WKA outlaws Tire Prep and Cutting 9/27/06

Ya know I just see kart racing go down hill because of what is going on with local tracks. I would love to see 70 karts at Bedrcock and JYI every week. That way for the people that wanted to run both fri and sat nights would have a place to run with alot of karts in their class. The problem with all this is that no one wants to take control or even form alittle group that would make the local tracks all have the same set of rules. When it comes to tech I think everytrack should do the same thing. Yes, no one wants their motor torn down on Fri if they are planning on running Sat. If you are going to tech then you need to tech all year long. You might as well run weight classes with run what ya brung. Since Ben has the most experience running all over and from what I hear running big shows what do you think should be done to get kart counts up and get more people into karting around this area?
 
To RBracing I am not going to say anything bad about you saying cheating is going on. I use to always think that people were cheating when I first started kart racing and people were smokin my doors off. I have to agree though with motors that have ran at Bedrock and JYI in the past. I didn't always agree with the tech but like i said if you are going to tech then tech. It is a lose lose deal for the track owners because people are going to be mad no matter what.
 
I agree with Jackson on cheating! at Bedrock if u can get through the corners u can overcome a cheater but with out prep it would b very very hard!

OK i think the horse is dead on prep so im not going to say anything else on prep!:eek:

If a track would just tech consistantly and right and catch a few of the cheaters it would stop for the most part! Bedrock and Coulterville needs some good tech guys that r up to date on motors! tear down one motor a night or an obvious cheater. The main reason for people being called cheaters and u know who u r is you r sideways or cranking your steering wheel to the left and the right and killing people on the straightaways! it don't take a genius to figure out who the cheaters r.
One thing to do is have everyone buy there fuel at the track which shouldn't b a problem cause u have to have fuel anyway and u have to fill up at the hotshoot! cause i think there is some fuel cheaters also.
This would eliminate some of the cheaters:( and how much fuel do u burn in one night a gallon, just charge $4 extra on entry fee and theres your fuel for the night. u have to buy it anyway!
 
Cheating

I have not been in karting for long but I have been a die hard nhra fan for years and I do know the smell and the burning sensation of nitro and at least one class at bedrock has one or two karts with nitro in their kart. I do not know if it is in their fuel,oil, or on their air filter.
 
So i have to ask the question what is Bedrock does try to get rid of tire prep. Are there karts that will not show up because of this or is everyone just going to complain about it the whole time?
 
Man Rodney, your post had me laughing for 5 minutes. :D

I was standing in the hot shoot at Bedrock last Friday night and you can smell something a little different sometimes, it burns your eyes a little. It's hard to tell what it is or whose running it, but you have a pretty good idea. Rodney's right, a good set of tires and prep is the only chance we have to beat a cheater. I gotta say though, if you are cheat'n, and you get beat, ****s to be you! :eek:

I agree with all those who believe if the local tracks are going to tech, then they need to tech all the time and tech every class. I don't like standing around after the races waiting for tech, but it's the right thing to do to make the racing fair.

34 gfmf, people are gonna race with or without tire prep. Those who want to win are gonna do what it takes to win with or without tire prep. If they can't spend money on prep, they'll spend it on something else to be faster. The thing is, there are very few ways to completely stop people from using prep, and a local track just doesn't have the funds for that.

Justin
 
Heres a tip. Not that anyone asked me, but if you start profiling cams and sniffing air filter, and oil (yes the oil) , I think you'll see some karts slowing down a bit.

When I raced stock appearing back in the day . I had a legal lift cam with a cheater profile, and that thing hauled some serious hiney. No one checks profile, and you can gain a TON of torque that way.

There are however ALOT of good fast karters that are stone cold legal.

I don't care if your racing tricycles in a wal mart parking lot. You got to do your homework. Alot of newcomers don't and get discouraged.

Tire prep isnt the problem. Its cheap compared to the overall cost. However, I always thought lack of tech ran alot of folks off. Dont blame them either.

Tire prep is a chemical hazard, and it would be nice to be able to police it, but I dont see how you will on a local level.
JMO
 
Tires

What about having a tire compound rule? Restricted classes 11's or 22's. Stock 44's or 33's ect... ( burris tire rule for local tracks ) Cuts down on tire cost. Tech fuel and oil every night before feature. Tech winning kart,,,,,,,,,, pop-up carb ect...after feature. Ben , if you took away prep and cut tires, set-up motor and driver would come back into play, not money. Old karts will beat new karts.
 
goody78rsg; I agree, a tire compound rule would make things cheaper for the racer who is planning on running Bedrock only. I can tell you many of the karts that ran in the front at Bedrock never changed compounds all night so a compound rule wouldn't effect most people. 33's seemed to be the tire that worked the best this year for a lot of racers. I also believe fuel and oil should be checked every night on the top 3 karts.

As far as taking away prep and cut tires, I agree with Signmaster, I just don't see it happening on a local level. It's just not that easy. It would cost too much for local track owners to police tire prep. There are preps that don't change the duro, can't be detected with a standard (Sniffer), and you don't have to bring the prep to the track. So if you had a compound rule, a sniffer, and a durometer check, you could still use prep. Believe me, I agree that not using prep would put kart racing back to setup, gear, and motor, but the chances a truely being able to police it is slim.

Justin
 
I think the best way for local track would be the pump around for fuel so every kart has the same fuel in it.frank doest have the time to tech every kart for fuel before each race.though is a great ideal.all i know is we need to some how stop the people that are junk in the corners and a rocket down the straight away.there was a kart in junior class last week that ran in grass down back straight for several laps and didnt lose a spot to karts two or three lenghts behind.i would love to see no prep but dont dont know how or who could police it.my be brandon could come help at track on fridays.there was a junior kart this year who ran a whole nite with no plate.this is a tough subject with no easy answers.all i know is thanks frank for putting up with all the bs at the track and giving us a place to race.
 
Carl's got it right, when your junk in the corner and a rocket down the straightaway, something ain't right. And Carl has Musgrave power so he ain't hurt'n for horsepower.
 
Looks like They are using a 4 to 6 gas meter to snife a tire to see if it has been preped. It might be able to be policed after all!!!! I for 1 would like to see no prep at track! I beleve it takes away from #1setup,#2 driver ability,& to say youy wouldnt be able to get around the track with out it is BS!!!, we got around with out it for years, Does it improve lap times? Well hell Yes!, But it in opinion is drivers crutch, as it takes some well alot of setup out of the the game , Having problems geting hold of the track that night lets just put on some tire prep!!!!!!!! & as far as being cheaper to run prep vesus not. ther are 26 races in a season a the rock, it is my under standing that a set of tires are basicly junk after 4 to 6 nights of preping. using my basic math, that means you are going to buy at least 4- to 6 sets of tires per season!!! at a average of say $300.00 a set that is $1200 to $1800.00 on tires. In my opinion that is out of control!!!. I dont see how that is cheaper than buying a couple of sets of different compounds & runing all year!!! I did not use prep last year at all!!! I did watch some of my competition use it last year, some times it helped! some times it did not. I have watched some of my competition buy 3 sets of tires since mid sean this year!! I am still running on sets of tires from last 2 years, & I am not preping my tires every week!! I tried some prep for the 1st time about 3 weeks ago,I will agree, It does make a huge difference mostly on very dry track. if you want to take prep out of the game we need to ask for a tacky track!! that would help take prep out of the game, not eleminate it but help reduce it. In my opinion prep is a crutch!!! but that is just my opinion. I will check on what a meter cost to see if it is feasible to make the effort to police it.4 gas meters are not cheap !!!


As far a techin goes the rules say you can pro test a kart for $100.00 but you must be back farter than 5 th place to protest. wich seems a little un fair if you 2nd to 5th maybe you guys should show up to the rule meeting this year & see if you can get that changed.& then get the no prep rule in place. Then you could afford to protest your competition!!!!
BUT THATS JUST MY OPINION!!!
 
Disagree

The last 3 nites I ran I could have probably used a new set of tires but I was not going to spend money on burris with only a couple of weeks left and I was on a different chassis and was not sure if it was set up or tires. I prep every week and have been running the same 2 sets of tires 1 set bought used (thanks tobin) for 2 years now. Yes some prep will ruin a tire in a few nites but not all do so. 2 sets of tires both 44s preped differently 1 new (400) 1 used (200) 90 or so in prep. 690 for 2 years or 345 a year in tires and prep. Could I have been faster on new rubber yes but that is true with unprepped tires. As little bite as bedrock has on certain nights the racing would get dangerous with all the karts sliding around in the corners without prep IMO. I agree about giving the track some bite and the prep becomes less of a factor because you do not need to soften the tires. Some will still prep and maybe be faster but a well set up kart will keep up on a high bite track. (Prepping does not take all set up out of karting it might make it more forgiving but you will not just throw a kart together and go race with the right prep and do well.) Your set up still needs to be there to win even with prep and for back in the day some were still doing things to their tires just wasnt as well known about. Prep is used in other forms of racing also they are just alot more sneeky about it. Everybody have a great winter. Andy
 
My Opion

THIS IS JUST MY OPION AND NOT THAT IT MATTERS BUT WE HAD A GREAT HANDLING KART FRIDAY NIGHT AND WE HAD 2ND IN THE FIRST HEAT TILL THROTTLE BRACKET BROKE AND HAD 2ND HEAT WON UNTIL CLUCTH TOOTH BROKE OFF AND WE ARE IN JUNIORS BUT THEN FEATURE COMES AND THERE WAS CERTIAN KARTS THAT MADE US LOOK LIKE OUR **** HAD A TOATER HOME BEHIND IT AND I HAD A BRAND NEW SBR MOTOR ON WHICH IS BEST IN THE BUS SO YEA SOMETHING HAS TO BE GOING ON WHEN UR **** ROCKETS PAST US DOWN THE STRAIGHTS SO TO FRANK THANKS FOR THE PLACE TO RACE AND SORRY WE DIDNT MAKE OUT ALL YEAR BUT YEA A SPADE IS A SPADE AND THERE ARE ALOT OF CHEATERS THERE AND FRANK AND THE CREW WILL GET THEM SOONER OR LATER.PS THANKS JIMMY FOR THE USE OF THE CLUTCH AND TOBIN CAN I HAVE UR AUTOGRAPH WWW.BENTOBIN04.COM
 
Carl I think i may be getting a kart for next year.We are selling out of the sprint car stuff which will be gone in a couple weeks.I just hate to see kart racing cost get up there so much. It would be so nice to show up down at Bedrock on a Friday night to see 70 karts. I would probly come down to the track and help out if i didn't work til 5 and then live in Edwardsville. To the post about SBR motors. I do not give a crap about who your motor builder is because I have been to the Shootout to watch SBR get torn down to find their motors illegal. It all comes down to what you tell that motor builder or what that motor builder is doing on a local level for hp. I am by no means any sorta way an expect on motors because that is why I have someone build my motors cause i have no clue but the facts are there. An earlier post stated different things that MOST tracks do not tech. Motor builders are not dumb they want their motors up front and winning to sell more stuff. Well at the local level they will do things that will past most tech's. Like i said if you are going to do a tech then tech everything. There has to be a way to solve this. I am not a 100% sure on this but I think that myself and Kurt W would probly have been the first two people to start running stuff on the tires. So in other words Bedrock has been around for a while and there was a ton of racing with no tire prep. Yes, the lap times are faster i am sure and karts get through the corner better but there has to be a reason that WKA is trying to get rid of it. So i guess we will have to wait and see how they take of the problem before anyone else can do anything.
 
Hey Bengi when you fall out of the cherry tree. Dont prep at Quincy let me know how fool your cherry basket gets. We wont prep at Isom and when we get back i give all the cherrys in our basket:D P.S. if your passing out autographs Kevin and I want our cut:eek: RAH RAH MILLINEUM ALL THE WAY TO THE CHERRY TREE!
 
Carl, there are a lot of preps that work very well and don't ruin your tires. Ashley ran 1 set of 33's from mid season on. We never changed a tire for hot laps, heats, or a feature unless we needed to change stagger (and then it was only the LR.) You are right, there are aggressive preps that will ruin a tire in a short time, but you don't need them to win at Bedrock in the stock classes. It would definitely help out with those big horsepower motors you build! :D

As far as always having a tacky track, well that takes a lot of driving ability out of the game too. Everybody's fast/faster on a tacky track. A race track needs to start off tacky and end of up dry. In the stock and outlaw class, if the track was tacky all night, most likely the most HP would win. I'm not saying setup wouldn't matter, but you know what I mean.

*Ashley and I have looked into the gas meter deal, it will catch most preps, but it won't catch them all. If you figure it out, there's gonna be a lot of big time karting organizations who want to know you.

Justin
 
34gfmf, the main reason WKA is trying to get rid of tire prep is because some of it is dangerous and illegal to have. i can't say that i blame them.
 
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