Congratulations George W. & Matt Blunt

This is really pathetic

T.nie I never said it was my work and yes it was from an email. But if you cannot see what the administration has done to this country you are like a horse with blinders on ! The unemployment in this country is terrible!
THE COUNTRY IS BROKE! Tell me one thing that they have done for this country in the past 4 years besides war?
 
Millsey, I stand corrected! Wishicoulddrive's comment to t-nie was uncalled for. I also did not notice the title to his post. (stand corrected again.... damn!) I don't know what the issue is with the cut and paste article. It looks to me like some of those statements are true, some greatly exagerated and others are nonsense. No different than several of the posts on this thread.

No high horse here t.nie. Just think that the finger pointing and name calling is out of hand. (baby killer, fag lover, nazi, stupid, fun with KY jelly). I have read some well written posts; some I agree with others I don't. I figure that I have been wrong enough in my life that it makes sense for me to think about what others say when they disagree with me.


Millsey I think that you summed up my thoughts real well in an earlier post:

Hey folks, I just got through watching two very, very impressive speeches. First the best speech John Kerry made during the past 18 months and then President Bush's speech. Both spoke of coming together and putting our differences apart to work together. They were both speaking from the heart and for the well-being of our country. I hope we all can somehow find the strength and courage to do exactly what they asked. I didn't vote for Kerry, but he really showed me what a great American he is by putting this all behind us now and trying to heal campaign wounds. If he had shown some of his genuine emotions during the campaign like he did today there might have been a different outcome. But I hope all of us can take a page out of Kerry's and Bush's speeches today and start working together insted of all the useless bickering.

Please dont refer to me as your dearest Millsey. I wouldn't want anyone to get the wrong idea! ;)

Kerry is a fag lover why do u think he got califonia? (Hammertime11)
 
You say that adoption is a humane alternative to abortion but what about all of those children that were left for adoption and were abused by the people the were in charge of their care. How many children come out of the system on the positive end as compaired to the negative, such as comiting vialant crimes themselves. Trading one victim for several victims seems a viable solution (sarcasm). I have a neice that fell way to far into the drug seen and lost her child to the system in which he became the victim of sexual abuse by a foster parent, an alcoholic brother that was the smartest of the 7 kids my mother had and raised basicaly by herself, a sister that physically abused her husband, and a sister that has been a large influence in the churches she attends on a regular basis.My family alone has some of the best and worst of what poeple may become so to say that adoption is a humane alternative is seing only the bright side.

Pro life would also apply to the death sentence so if killing is killing then the death penalty should be stopped as well.
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But don’t many unwanted pregnancies become battered children?

- Not so. The landmark study on this was done at the University of Southern California. Professor Edward Lenoski studied 674 consecutive battered children who were brought to the in- and out-patient departments of that medical center. He was the first to go to the parents and study to what extent they wanted and planned the pregnancy. To his surprise, he found that 91% were planned and wanted, compared to 63% for the control groups nationally. Further, the mothers had began wearing, on the average, pregnancy clothes at 114 days compared to 171 days in the control, and the fathers named the boys after themselves 24% of the time compared to 4% for the control groups. E. Lenoski, Heartbeat, vol. 3, no. 4, Dec. 1980

- Both parents (or parent figures) lived in 80% of the homes. Two-thirds of the mothers were "house-wives" and presumably were at home. Almost all mothers were in the 20-30 age group, and fathers were in the 20-35 age bracket. No special social, racial, or economic class predominated. Francis, "Child Abuse, A Nationwide Study," Amer. Humane Assn. & Child Welfare League, 1963

- The parents commonly "...grew up in a hostile environment, and were themselves abused. When the children fail to satisfy their [unrealistic, neurotic expectations of perfection] emotional needs, the parents react with the same violence they experienced as children." 258 J. Walsh, IL Dept. of Child and Family Services Newsweek, July 24, 1972

I’ve heard that adopted children have more problems than biological children.

This has been thoroughly debunked by Marquis and Detweiler. On seven separate measures, adopted persons rated their parents as superior as compared to their non-adopted peers.

"There is not a shred of evidence that indicates any of the previously reported negative characteristics of dependency, fearfulness, tenseness, hostility, loneliness, insecurity, abnormality, inferiority, poor self-image, or lack of confidence." If different, the adopted are more positive and better adjusted. Marquis & Detweiler, J. Personality and Social Psychology, abstract in Nat’l Adoption Report, May 1985

I’ve heard that adopted children need more psychiatric care, and generally are in more trouble and are less well adjusted than children in biologic homes.

The studies reporting such problems almost always were comparing apples with oranges and are therefore invalid. Here’s why. Biologic children go home with parents from the hospital, bond promptly, and, from birth, are reared by two (one) parents.

Adopted children often stay in institutions, in foster care, or in turbulent situations prior to adoption. Their future social and emotional instability is not due to adoption; it’s due to their environment prior to adoption.

The only valid comparison is between biological infants and adopted infants, both of whom went from the hospital to the home of their forever parents.

In fact, adopted children fare better. When compared with those adopted later, born outside of marriage and raised by the single mother, or raised in an intact family, children who are adopted in infancy:

- Repeat grades less often than any other group;

- See mental health professionals less than all other groups, except children of intact families;

- Have better health status than all other groups;

- Have a better standing in their school classes than all other groups, except children raised in intact families; and

- Have fewer behavior problems than all other groups, except children raised in intact families. And so do their birth mothers. Significantly, teenage mothers who choose adoption also do better than mothers who choose to be single parents.

- They have higher educational aspirations, are more likely to finish school, and less likely to live in poverty and receive public assistance than mothers who keep their children. Bachrach, Stolley, and London, "Relinquishment of Premarital Births"

- They delay marriage longer and are more likely to marry eventually.

- They are more likely to be employed 12 months after the birth and less likely to repeat out-of-wedlock pregnancy.

- They are no more likely to suffer negative psychological consequences, such as depression, than are mothers who rear children as single parents. S. McLaughlin et al., "Do Adolescents Who Relinquish . . . Better or Worse . . . Raise Them?," Fam. Plan. Persp., Jan. 1988

All the goals of liberal government programs like job training, supplemental education, and family planning are attained with greater ease, and at lower cost, through adoption. P. Fagan, Liberal Welfare Programs, "Data . . . Teen Mothers," Heritage Found., #1031, Mar. 31, 1995





Excerpts taken from http://www.abortionfacts.com/

Quite the online resource for abortion information. They answered your accusations better than I could.

I will however, respond to the death penalty comment. The death penalty applies to adults, not teenagers, or children, who have committed crimes with the full knowledge and understanding of their actions.

Abortion is the death penalty for the innocent unborn.

It is not hard to see that there is a huge difference.
 
Larry in Columbia said:
No high horse here t.nie. Just think that the finger pointing and name calling is out of hand. (baby killer, fag lover, nazi, stupid, fun with KY jelly).
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None of which can be attributed to me, other than the stupid comment toward wishIhadabrainsoIcouldformanoriginalthoughtinsteadofcuttingandpastingstupidemails. After he called everyone stupid with the title of his post.

All that other junk I just ignore. Kids these days.
 
t.nie,
My experience and reading I have done on the matter indicates that people who have experienced abuse or violence as children and early teens are more likely to be abusive or violent as adults. I would think that children whether adopted or natural children, who have a stable family environment and feel safe, secure, wanted and have appropriate structure grow to be health adults. I know several families with adopted kids and they are great families with well adjusted kids. I think that, as with birth families, there are probably some "bad" adoptive parents. I think (hope), however, that these "bad" parents are in the vast minority. I would hope that adoption would be seen as an alternative for any mother with an unwanted pregnancy.

Do you guys think that a person who is pro-life should be opposed to the death penalty if he/she is to be consistent with his position? It is kind of ironic in that a lot of people who are pro-life often support the death penalty and many pro-choicers are often for abolition of the death penalty. (I know... these are generaliztions)
 
No problem at all Larry.. Thanks for the post and I swear I'll never refer to you as "dearest" again.... LOL...

By the way, don't you people think this post is getting a bit deep for a racing forum... LOL....
 
Yep. Blame it on me, Jeff... lol. ;) But, this whole thread has really remained largely civilized, I think. I have had far worse personal attacks in other argubates I have been in on here. :) Larry's cool, I think. I gave him some crap, but he didnt get mad. Just pmed me and threatened to burn my house down.:eek: :eek: Thats ok, I dont live in a house...;) :D :D
 
It just goes to show how divided we really are. We need to stop it now. I dived out of this thread a bit ago because of it. I have my views and none of you are not gonna change me and you all have your views and I'm not gonna change any of you. I just read all the posts over the last day for the first time and it is going to get ugly if it keeps going. I'm glad I left when I did.

Both candidates $ucked...all the candidates $ucked, one had to win. I don't agree with it but I have to deal with it. If we don't get it together soon we won't have to worry about it because we'll all be fighting each other and the terrorists will have what they have wanted all along...us to be at war with ourselves and be as miserable as they are. Those people in the Middle East have been fighting since the beginning of time and they will continue to fight with anyone who they can drag over there as long as people keep letting themselves get drug over there. Peace in the Middle East is a lost cause.
 
I know a three year old boy that is the neatest guy you will ever meat, his daddy was adopted at four days old in 1971. If Roe V Wade was earleir that three year old would not be here today, and nothing his daddy ever did would have happend. GOP all the way. I think this should be the last comment on this thread.
 
Thank God we all have the right to have a choice!!! It's horrible that we have OUR troops all over the world fighting for FREEDOM. But you know what? If we didn't do it WHO THE HELL WOULD?? Then it would just be a matter of time to where the entire world was just like the Middle East. All those people have known their entire life is war and fighting and injustice. God Bless us and God Bless the USA!
 
DAB73 said:
I own a convenience store so Quik Trip is not the first place I'd be looking for a job. I have to take care of all the day to day operations (not to mention keeping the books!). I have a couple of good employees which allows me to be able to get other things that need to be done...done. It still requires almost all the time I can gather. Some weeks I am able to cut it down a bit but not very often. Besides, it is 50 miles to the nearest Quik Trip from here. What many people don't understand about most business owners, we're not all rich. Just because we may have over a million dollars a year go through our hands doesn't mean we get to keep it all.

Anyway, I just have a couple of questions. Why is it everytime a Democrat states fact or truth a Republican has to come out and say 'oh quit yer whining'? It's not whining, IT'S THE TRUTH. Also, Just because you're a Democrat doesn't instantly make you a faggot-loving, baby-killing, pansy liberal. Granted, yes there are some faggot-loving, baby killing, pansy liberals out there. Not all of them are in the Democratic party.

I personally don't condone abortion. But, I think there are cases in which an abortion is a viable option and should be respected. However, I would want to have that option and if it is the wrong option I'll have to deal with that when my day comes. America is all about freedom and you have to take the good with the bad sometimes. I'm not Pro-Abortion I'm Pro-Choice.

Just like the gun control issue. I don't think anybody needs to own an automatic assault rifle. What the hell ya gonna use that thing for? It's like the old Skynyrd song "It ain't good fer nuthin', but put a man six feet in a hole". But believe me, I own plenty of guns. I can outfit a small army. I have never wanted nor needed an assault rifle.

Gay-marriage...Give 'em an island, put 'em all there and let 'em marry each other. Just keep 'em the hell away from me. BTW, I'm against it! I dislike queers! I was brought up right, I dont hate anybody! :)

(Now this is the important part) If they take away your choice for abortion or your right to buy an AK-47, what will they do next. No President is going to go straight out against the Bill of Rights. That would be political suicide. They all really like their job. Choice is freedom. Whether it is an abortion or assault rifles. You want one you should be able to get it. That is what has made America great for 228 years. There should be channels to go through to get it but, you should be able to get it.

Bush has a personal agenda of his own and does not have the best interest of the general public at heart. He has fallen to the same thing the rest of the whole damn world has...GREED! It is eating us alive. Everybody wants more, more, more and nobody gives a damn how they get it. That is the real moral issue that everyone needs to worry about. I'm sure I'm talking to the wind here but it is just my take on it and I'll stand by it. Bash away!
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Sorry DAB kinda got carried away and took it to a personal level and for that i apologize. Your views for the most part fall alot closer to the middle than they do to liberal from your post above. Nobody that has the ability to think on their own agrees totally with one parties agenda... nobody.

As far as the Quik Trip comment it was a generalization. Need4Speed is mostly correct, I believe that everyone is afforded an opportunity to improve themselves in this country. Whether its through grants, family supported, scholarship, or whatever, if you want an education you can get one. I believe that a doctor, lawyer, engineer, etc etc SHOULD be paid substantially more than a truck driver, warehouse worker, or non management food service employee. If everyone should make a similar wage, then what is the motivation for the next generation to become educated? If i spend 50-100k or whatever amount to finish the degree of choice on an education to train for a specific career and spend 4-10 yrs of my life in the process i deserve to be paid more... alot more. I am not belittling anyones chosen job, because i have been the truck driver, warehouse worker, and non management food service worker. I didnt like what i made so i improved my skills to get the job i wanted. Nobody paid for my education, I did, one class at a time because that is all i could afford at the time.
 
Well, I've been the upper level, higher paid skilled worker with a fair amount of management duties and been reduced to the low payed, bottom of the food chain, under appreciated disgruntled employee. It $ucks at the bottom. I've spent the last two years getting my dignity back. BTW, I have a college education. It doesn't do much good these days as college educations are getting to be the norm. Now it's how many azzes you can kiss and who you can beat down along the way. It seems these days the road to success is paved with azzholes to kiss and kick along the way. The best guy doesn't always win. I've been everything from a police dispatcher to convenience store clerk to laboratory technician(my union job and longest job for 6 years) to mobile DJ to auto parts man (parts specialist as O'reillys likes to call them, dumbazzes as the rest of the world calls them. They wanted me to be Assistant Manager but I didn't really feel like being called dip$hit for 10 cents an hour more.) back to DJ and now I own and manage a convenience store. Damn near right back where I started from. I get to hang out with cops now too so it's just about like old times. Not bad for being 31.

I don't think we need to end off endorsing anybody as Dean so close mindedly did. If you have anything to say it should be God Bless America because after it's all said and done we're all Americans. And most importantly we all come from the good mother Earth.
 
see DAB you have came full circle. I do see your point, dont agree with it totally but respect it none the less. Good luck with your store, Im sure its not easy at times.

CQCQ over and out... of this subject.
 
DAB73 said:
Well, I've been the upper level, higher paid skilled worker with a fair amount of management duties and been reduced to the low payed, bottom of the food chain, under appreciated disgruntled employee. It $ucks at the bottom. I've spent the last two years getting my dignity back. BTW, I have a college education. It doesn't do much good these days as college educations are getting to be the norm. .
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Tell me about it. I'm 27, have a B.A. in History, and only make 12k a year because even after 4.5 years of service--putting me at the top of my bracket--I still can't get more than 28 hours/week.

And that's for a UNION job...
 
I believe that a doctor, lawyer, engineer, etc etc SHOULD be paid substantially more than a truck driver, warehouse worker, or non management food service employee.
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No argument there. I believe that's pretty much the way things are. But at the same time, don't people who "choose" to work with their backs or hands deserve to make a "living" wage? After all without them, who would you have to do all those "menial" tasks. And I don't really think you can compare truck driving or construction jobs to flipping burgers.
non management food service employee
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Ever been a 40 year old who's had the same type of job for 20 years, based his or her whole life on the wages they were making only to have that job disappear because the company can pay lower wages overseas? Do skilled laborers not deserve to make good money because they didn't go to college, even though most people can't duplicate their skills? Jobs that require a better than average education should pay more...but does that mean the rest of the world should have to work for $5 a hour?

I do apologize to Need4Speed if I sounded discouraging. Being young is a wonderful thing, get your education and run with it. I wish you all the best.
 
Third Party?

It sounds like we are starting to identify those things that we have in common and agree upon. Maybe we should start a third party. The DIRT Party! We have a few years to develop a platform and select our candidates. We could hold our party's convention at a local dirt track.
Can you spend federal matching campaign funds on beer?
 
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